Even Greener Pastures

Your observations are accurate. In my part of the U.S. we say 'wide spot in the road' for what could be properly called a village. If we describe someplace as a village, it's with reluctance and a shrug of the shoulders, since we don't use the word in common parlance. It sounds dismissive to call a place nothing more than a wide spot in the road, I realize that. But that's the way it is. 

I attended school in one of these wide spots. We had the school, a very small restaurant, a small gas/service station, church, and a used car lot. Today, the restaurant and school are gone. The population has held steady at roughly 30-50 people.

Villager has a negative connotation in the Georgian language. It translates as goimi. No one wants to be a goimi.

What problem?

If it's a village, call it a village.

Same in German: Dorf (village) is fine, while Dörfler (villager) is not, it sounds dismissive.

As to the original question - we haven't got a lot of palm trees* in Germany, but when talking about the Caribbean, what else are you going to call them?

*Although they might be starting to grow here in the near future, what with the wholly imaginary climate change.

Hmmm, trying to hijack Nikola's thread, eh? Have you forgotten that it's Steve's job to hijack threads with the War and Peace size monuments to all things German?

Well, Steve, what do you say in place of village for small places in the U.S.?

An interesting picture is emerging here. So, in the US, the land of the ...well... big, it seems that being small is negative.  A place that only has a handful of houses is a hole, a dump, a hick town.

While in Europe, meanwhile, small can be traditional, quaint, charming even.

An interesting picture is emerging here. So, in the US, the land of the ...well... big, it seems that being small is negative.  A place that only has a handful of houses is a hole, a dump, a hick town.

While in Europe, meanwhile, small can be traditional, quaint, charming even.

You said it perfectly SuKi. Yes, the smaller the place gets the worse it tends to get. But, it works the other way too. Too big gets lousy too. There‘s probably a good medium somewhere.

Quote from: SuKi on July 11, 2019, 12:25:11 pm

traditional, quaint, charming even.

We have that sort of place here, as well. The difference is that they're planned that way as tourist towns. They feauture things like antiques stores, ice cream parlors, gift shops, maybe an old canal. That sort of thing. And they may have ten or fifteen year-round residents.

We have a lot of room to spread out and start new towns or cities. That's one reason why we have so many dying and dead towns.

Yes, there are a lot of those places, but they are really just tourist traps. They are sort of fake and artificial, obviously designed for the visitors.

It’s a bit like „if you’ve seen one, you’ve seen them all.“

We have 60,000+ villages in India. Come over here if you want to know the cartography of a village But one thing I often get confused when people from the West say that they live in the valley. I mean there should be village(s) in a valley, right? Or the word valley is used in place of village? Could someone shed some light on this matter?

Yes, "we live in the valley", absolutely used in the US.

In Los Angeles, and maybe even more of California the richer people live in 'The Hills' (like Beverly Hills) and the poorer in 'The Valley', generally because the hills are cooler and have less problems with smog.
"The Valley" around Los Angeles is called San Fernando and is very large.  It is usually at lest 10 degrees f higher than the beach or the hills.

"Living in the valley" in the rest of the US does not have a poor connotation, indeed river valleys tend to be nice places to live - greener and more sheltered from the weather.  The word has nothing to do with 'village' tho, valley dwellers still usually live in what they would call "small towns".

Well you would only say I live in THE valley if the other person knew what valley you were referring to.  To someone else you would say I live in a valley, to someone who would know the location "I live in the Hudson River Valley" or "Hudson Valley" etc... For the most part people are referring to river valleys and they tend to be nicer places to live.

You could possibly get away with saying I live in "The Valley" if you meant the San Fernando Valley around LA.  Movies and songs have made it the best known valley in the US, and it is huge and densely populated.  There is even a ridiculous dialect/accent associated with that valley, the famous "Valley Girl" of the 80's/90's.  You can look up that accent on YouTube or the movie "Clueless".

I think that unlike "village", which is used in countries that have... well... villages, and not just in English but in other languages as well (whatever equivalent they use), the word "valley" and its equivalents are not used much for logical reasons. Unless there are hills or mountains, it's rather pointless to emphasize that you live in a valley. Besides, most places have official names and some have unofficial, local names, so around locals, you would refer to the place by using its name. In Neal's example, "The Valley" is used as a proper noun. I'm trying to think of an example where "I live in the valley" would sound natural and it would literally have to be a very remote place with just a few houses scattered around, and you, a stranger, would have to be in the mountains, asking someone if they lived nearby. Then, maybe, they'd say "I live down in the valley". Maybe not The chances are certainly slimmer than they would have been a couple of centuries ago.

I'm still trying to figure out how the Ngram works. I found this for "in the valley":

Does anyone remember Elvis telling us there will be peace in the valley?

Here's another one:



From this valley they say you are going.
We will miss your bright eyes and sweet smile,
For they say you are taking the sunshine
That has brightened our pathway a while.

So come sit by my side if you love me.
Do not hasten to bid me adieu.
Just remember the Red River Valley,
And the cowboy that has loved you so true.

Jerry I think that was when he was singing Gospel, and there are some Biblical connotations with valley.  Armageddon is supposed to take place in the Megiddo Valley, where the blood of the fallen will rise to the height of the horse bridles.  There is the famous "Valley of the Shadow of Death" from Psalm 23, where David will fear no evil.

Many Bible valleys are not happy places :-)

That's interesting to know more about it. Thank you everyone for sharing dome interesting information. Actually, I heard this word used more by Americans than British. I don't know where I read it but an American lady wrote that she was a "valley girl" and until that moment, I had no idea what she meant but I guessed that she might be from any outskirts of city area or any rural areas(village as we say here).